The Importance of Views

I'm not sure you can group city views all into one category as there are huge differences between views; I'd suspect a good view of the top landmark buildings (empire, chrysler, woolworth, etc) would command a higher premium than a generic cityscape view (like UES facing north let's say).

I agree that when it comes to Manhattan the view is where it's at. No where else on earth can you get the views associated with a MANHATTAN skyline, that is what makes people smile in awe. Views of mountaintops and waterviews? yes that's nice too but there are ALOT of those. But a Manhattan view? Well there is only one place for that.

great point J$.

Also, I should have pointed out a very important statement in this post. What I meant to say was that I am noticing many buyers consider locations outside their original zones, because they cant find the product they want and the price they can afford.

But when they find the product outside this favored zone, that has amazing view of park, river, or famous buildings, they are much quicker to raise their bid or bid more aggressively to get that product.

Of course I dont mean that location is meaningless and that someone who was once considering UES, will now move to E harlem because of a view. Just that people are more open to look outside their favored location these days.

So , you are saying we should all ideally move to Jersey City so we can get a view of Manhattan..don't think so , I will stay in Manhattan thanks.

Adrian - NO! Where did I say that? You said that! All I said is that park and river views get top dollar at resale! More so than location in todays environment where many buyers consider locations outside their original areas.

If you are a buyer, Im sure you originally had a neighborhood you wanted to buy in. As you search, I promise you will start considering other areas. That dynamic diminshes the strength of location as a permanent feature that gets the most resale dollars!

All Im saying is try to find a property with a view that seems to be priced 'in line' with those apts that dont have the view.

"Your focus should be to find a property type that enjoys park views, but whose asking price is more 'in line' with the last comparable sale that did NOT have the luxury of that gorgeous view! "

But your prob a curbed reader and mis-interpret the point of the post.

I totally disagree. I recently left a high floor apartment downtown with the best views of Midtown I've ever seen. The view was entertaining for about the first month, and then I just took it for granted. Frankly, I'll take location and space over views, and as a buyer, that's exactly what I did. Also, in Manhattan, usually a good view means a high floor and I can think of plenty of reasons not to live 30+ stories above the ground.

Sunchild - THANK YOU for a great comment! Finally! When you sold the apt with the great views of midtown, did you get top dollar?

or was that a rental? Curious to see if the apt with great views sold quickly and got your price?

Thanks for sharing your thoughts and real experience. I certainly can buy into that way of thinking and Im sure there is a percentage of buyers out there now that share those thoughts!

That second one has a nice view but for many people, that is cancelled out by being on a noisy highway.

What are your thoughts on a lower floor but treetop views which are quite nice, and produces a nice barrier of privacy - as opposed to staring into someones bedroom?

blbernst - its a great question! I find that in general, lower floors are a bit harder to sell due to buyers concerns over security and noise/dust. So its hard to ask top dollar as a seller and be happy with traffic and expect strong bids.

But then there are a subset of buyers who want a lower floor (whether its religion cause you cant use elevators on Fri/Sat, or they have a pet and want to be closer to ground floor, or just prefer lower floors), who actually appreciate that kind of tree top view. Its a matter of getting the perfect buyer at the right time.

But in general, lower floor units are hard to price super aggressively simply because views are treetop.

Hi Noah-

As a recent buyer in LIC, we jumped on our 2bed/2bath apartment in a new condo because it has 680 sq/ft. private yard with patio and grass BUT the unit is on the second floor (parking garage on the first floor) and faces north so no direct sunlight and our "view" from all rooms is our yard. We knew these factors before we bought, plan on staying put for 6-8 years and are thrilled with our decision but I'm wondering how to price such outside space and does this make our unit more buyer specific? Without the outside space being taken into consideration at all, we're at $764 per square foot for our unit... but how would you come up with price per square foot with the yard included? Thanks for your work on the blog...

Ethan

What are your thoughts on the pricing differential between a low floor unit that faces the street versus one that faces the back of another building (say a brick wall 10 feet behind the window)? If they both get good light, is the street view always preferable? I'm not sure people are more inclined to look out on crowds, traffic, noise as opposed to the back of a building.

views - really depends on if the back view is dirty, and makes the apt dark & dreary..10ft is not much at all. Im sure some sun gets in, but not flooded by any means.

Tough to answer because its all in the eyes of the buyer and there is no formula for this.

Ethan - I think the same way! My last apt had a 660 sft terrace and I loved it, on 2nf floor, and fully landscaped so that it was like a private backyard.

I ended up getting an extra $100/sft or so as a premium for that space. It was on market for 3 1/2 months, of course priced a bit high in beginning and I turned down an offer in week 1 that would have been a bit higher than what I accepted 3 months later (i did blgo about this), but I found that out of 40 buyers that came through, there were still concerns about 2nd floor.

In the end, I found about $100 premium for the space based on similar sales at that time.

The case I'm thinking of is a pretty standard brick wall, not something particularly ugly (well not that a brick wall is attractive in any way). There's no formula for this, but my question was given two units that get the same amount of light, is it a definite market premium getting a street view over a brick wall view, or is it not that significant in terms of pricing?

tough to answer because:

for a buyer who values quiet & privacy YES

for a buyer that wants to see life outside their window and get more sunlight YES

Me personally, I would prefer the 2nd floor tree top street view. But thats just me cause I dont like looking at walls.

Noah-I agree with your 2nd floor tree top views perspective. My wife and I decided on 3rd floor tree top views which are beautiful year round over 13th floor staring at the black top of another building-No Empire State views. The prices were fairly similar (a little premium on the higher floor-but we liked the views better). Security wasn't a concern in our doorman building, yes you get a little noise from the street now and then but as most will conlude-the noise blends in with everything else after time...look at all the cherry blossoms this time of year-much better than a brick wall.

Noah - in your example, are you suggesting that there should be a $75K premium for the "view" - seems a little steep with everything else being equal.

for almost a 700 sft private garden space, just under the size of the entire interior space, I think 50K-75K is in-line as a premium. Of course, I havent seen this space, but with very little money, you can fully landscape a terrace of that size to look amazing.

I was referring to when you said:

"Now, lets say that there are similar property types (say a 1BR unit w/ same floorplan) on both sides of the building! One has Exposure A and the other has Exposure B. Now lets assume that these comparable, yet opposing units are around the same floor in height, thereby eliminating any significant premium for being on a higher floor. Pricing should be as follows:

1BR w/ Exposure A (park views) ---> aprox $900,000
1BR w/ Exposure B (interior views) ---> aprox $825,000"

Well the piece was written originally in October, but I think the principal applies close to that level.

I would expect the park view property to sell at a 65-75K premium; park views are hard to come by and there is a subset of buyers who are willing to pay for that luxury.

I wonder if there is a difference between first and second or third time buyers on this.

The first place I bought had great open city views, even to the Empire State Building. But over time I "forgot" about the view, and only really wanted the light.

For my second place, consistent and protected light was essential, but I was not willing to pay a premium for a view - space, location, transportation and school district were the key factors.

Everything is a trade off, but location was still absolute tops for me, over view or anything. Lots of the "view" apartments are in weird locations (600's West 40's - where the heck is that? ), Sutton Place, East End Ave.. Far from transportation and not very amenity, restaurant, or shopping friendly places. Riverside Park and Central Park are nice, but I wouldn't buy a place there only for the view, given what the money might buy elsewhere.

you raise a great point Buyer! That would be an interesting poll to see results of. However, I have found that in past few years, as prices skyrocketed, buyers put a bit less emphasis on location, and all of a sudden were willing to move outside their PRIMO location neighborhoods to get features like light/views at the same price that might otherwise wouldnt get in their top location choice.